Release Date: February 20, 2025
For the complete transcript of the earnings call, please refer to the full earnings call transcript.
Q: Richard, you mentioned that one of the downward impacts on orders in the quarter was related to hybrid bonding. Could you help us understand if this was due to a change in the market or customer level, or was it more about normal quarterly fluctuations? Also, what's your confidence level on the mainstream part of your business improving in the second half? A: Hybrid bonding orders typically show a lumpy nature, characterized by orders in certain quarters followed by deliveries. We expect this pattern to continue. In 2024, we increased customers using hybrid bonding from 9 to 15, including new entries in Korea and Japan. Regarding the mainstream business, while some customers have reduced headcount, we see positive signs of recovery in AI and high-end computing. The downturn has been long, likely due to post-COVID effects, but we expect a recovery as inventories decrease and utilization rates improve.
Q: Could you provide some guidance on hybrid bonding growth for 2025? Will it be as strong as 2024? Also, how does the current downturn in mainstream assembly equipment compare to previous downturns? A: It's early to predict 2025, but we see significant adoption in logic and potential demand for capacity. The key will be whether HBM adopts hybrid bonding. The downturn in mainstream assembly is not as deep as in 2015 or 2018-2019, thanks to new technologies like hybrid bonding and photonics, which have helped offset declines.
Q: There are reports suggesting that some companies might not need hybrid bonding for certain applications. Does this affect your view on demand for hybrid bonding tools? A: We haven't heard definitive statements against hybrid bonding. While some processes like TC NXT are also in development, hybrid bonding offers performance benefits like better heat dissipation and less power consumption. We continue to see interest and development in hybrid bonding, and our strategy includes a complete portfolio to address various interconnect needs.
Q: Can you provide an overview of where your 15 hybrid bonding customers are in the adoption curve? A: We have customers in various stages, from R&D to volume production. In the US and Taiwan, we have significant logic device programs. In Korea and Japan, we are in early development stages. Our customers include major players in logic and memory, and we are seeing adoption across different regions and applications.
Q: How do you define AI-related applications, and what products are you supplying to these markets? A: We define AI-related applications as those related to high-end computing and data centers, including 2.5D and 3D logic. Our products for these markets include hybrid bonding, photonics, and certain flip-chip applications. Hybrid bonding orders were the largest within this segment in 2024.
For the complete transcript of the earnings call, please refer to the full earnings call transcript.
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